MR60

World Record for Duration of Flight

3689563453?profile=original
1 hour 20 minutes
- APM 2.5 takes the world record for Multi-Copter Duration of Flight powered by a rechargeable battery. [note:  records also exist for hover that can occur indoors and take advantage of ground affect]

Flight Requirements:

- Distance > 1 kilometer

- Minimum elevation from ground the greater of 2 meters or two prop diameters (no ground affect)

- Lands within 50 meters of Launch

- Minimum of two way points > 0.25 km apart

- Altitude Climbs: Two climbs > 100 meters each

- Ends before voltage drops below recommended minimum level for recharging

- Flight over ground that does not vary more than + 20 meters in elevation

Actual Flight

- Distance: 1 - 2 km

- Min elevation 2 meters

- Ended at start

- Three way points with two 0.3 km apart

- Two climbs:  126 meters and 112 meters

- 13.06 volts left with 10 volt recommended minimum

- Ground + 10 meters

Time:  > 1hr and 20 minutes (81.43 minutes)

Multi-copter:

- Octa 2XQuad 6Up+2Dn (wanted to fly something novel that would show off the flexibility of APM 2.5)

- 3.18 kg AUW

- Li-Ion battery

Attached are the flight logs.  Later I'll provide:

o Video

o Earthview of flight

o Altitude gains

o Details of the copter (design and weights)

2013-11-26 11-41 187.kmz

2013-11-26 11-41 187.log

2013-11-26 11-41 187.log.gpx

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Replies

            • MR60

              It will be slightly more efficient in net-lift when accounting for the additional frame weight required for the additoinal 1/2" or frame when using a 16" prop.  But 15" is fine.

              Drawing 5 amps per motor at hover for 20amps total:  18 AWG is overkill but OK (optimal when drawing 1.5x hover).  20 AWG is optimal for wires between the power distribution and ESC and ESC to the motors between hover and normal flight speed.

              Your ship duration calc:

              - first see if you can decrease weight.

                ... save 20 grams and replace the PDB with a 3DR Power module and wire nuts.

                ... save 120 grams by bonding 1-ply x 1/8" carbon skin balsa core sandwich panels for the motor mounts

                ... save 210 grams by replacing the center plate with an engineered sandwich panel

               ...  save 90 grams by replacing the skid with pool noodle feet

               ...  save 54 grams by eliminating the 16mm clamp with aerospace adhesive

               

              Remind me again.  Li-Ion or Li-Po?  If Li-Ion you need to engineer the C.  Li-Ion is about 1C. This is critical for a duration and distance calculation.

              Your calculation accounts for:

              - battery capacity

              - amp rate

              - % of the battery that can be used

              That will result in a ballpark number.  So not bad.  But if you want to really nail it, you need to calculate:

              - actual ship amp rate at speed and hover (using individual motor usage x 4 is not that accurate as the ship will not be 100% efficient; more like 90% efficient as the motors fight one another to maintain balance)

              - the voltage drop of the battery when under load

              - the resulting amp increase since volts x amps must equal watts

              - the watt decrease through time since the ship becomes more efficient (takes slightly fewer watts to fly) as voltage drops

              - the change in volts of the battery through discharge time and the proportional impact on amps through discharge time

              - the non-linear drop in volts through discharge time as you approach the end (80% is only a guess)

               But your approach will give you the ballpark.  Well done.

              • Thanks for going through my calculation.

                I manage to save some grams by replacing the CF round tube and clamp into aluminium square tube with inner ribs for more rigidity (hopefully). So no clamps and motor mount needed, just add nuts to lift the motor because the shaft is pressing to the tube:

                3702899878?profile=original

                Will try to cut the center plate weight also but playing with balsa perhaps not suitable for me right now, but what do you mean with "engineered sandwich panel"?

                For the skid, will definitely try the pool noodle feet.

                For the battery, I will use 2 unit Li-Ion battery in parallel from rangevideo.com link.

                I assume it will generate 1C x 18.3A = 18.3A, my target hover will be 20A. Slightly over but the battery spec said it can deliver max 2C = 36.6A so not worried on that.

                I will try to monitor the real amp consume when this bird is flying to get the real calculation on several condition (hover, fly, fly with wind, etc).

                Interested to know, are you saying that forward flying will eventually more efficient than hover from your statement below: 

                "- the watt decrease through time since the ship becomes more efficient (takes slightly fewer watts to fly) as voltage drops"

                I'm using 80% battery capacity on the flight time calculation and using only 75% of flight time to estimate the travel distance assuming that forward flight will consume more Amp compare to hover.. CMIIW.. and also add ~ 15% from the published amp consumption from tiger motor website. 

                Finally, just hopping that Tiger Motor is not lying on their motor amp consumption because all of this was based on their spec alone.

                Anyone has calculation based on an experience with this motor real consumption?

                3702900119?profile=original

                BTW:

                - I'm planning to speed up to 15 m/s for flight mission, do you think the quad will be able to handle such speed?

                - I will try this ESC Sunrise BLHELI Multi Series 20A 2-6S (include wires) to cut more weight, hopefully it will work with low rpm motor. What ESC do you use on the world record quad ?

                Thanks again for your time to response this.. :)

                13x13x340mm Aluminium Square Tube W/Inner ribs - Black
                13x13x340mm Aluminium Square Tube W/Inner ribs - Black from manufacturer , in category Tubes, Sheets etc. , DIY Parts - (Tubes/ Clamps/ Sheets/ Dame…
                • MR60

                  Try to achieve about 0.6 C or so at hove.  Then you will have adequate margin for flying in difficult situations.

                  This is easy to achieve if you keep cutting weight.  For example,

                  - the metal screws would be best replace by nylon 4/40 screws from 

                  http://www.mcmaster.com/#machine-screws/=tq4dpf 

                  These will shear off before damage is done to the props, motors, and ESC.

                  - cut a hole in the Al arm under the motor for the motor axle and cotter pin

                  Go crazy on weight removal.  Rufous for example has all of the covers to electronic components removed.  For a commercial ship this is not advised, but then again neither are Aluminum arms.  so maybe consider this ship as a test platform and get the weight down so it flies at a lower C.  Then you can go to carbon arms and put the covers back on.

                  Do not use balsa wood for the motor mounts or anything else.  A sandwich panel has one ply of carbon on the top and bottom side of a balsa, Nomex, or cork core. Since you are currently using Al square tubes, you don't need sandwich panel motor mounts.  It would just add weight.

                  The ESC I used should be identified on the blog.

                  Keep me in touch with how this goes and the C that you are finally flying.  

                  Flight behavior:

                  - As the voltage drops, the watts to keep the ship in the air slightly decreases.

                  - But as voltage drops, the amps increase almost proportional to the V drop.

                  - As you transition from hover to moderate speed, the watts required to fly decrease.

                  - As you transition to fast speed, the watts required to fly will greatly increase to more than the watts to hover. 

                  • Thanks for the nylon screws tips, first I think you must be crazy to use Nylon screws on Rufous but will try to find it locally since shipping from US to here will be tremendously expensive.

                    Since this quad were indeed to be "semi"-commercial so will stick on several gimmick part while still (as you said) go crazy with weight removal on i.e. center plate and landing skid.

                    Will keep posting the progress since I still waiting for several parts to arrive.

  • What a beautiful FAKE!

    If AUW stands for All Up Weight this post is only a beautiful FAKE.

    Sony nex5 + gimbal = 800g 

    8x MT3515 400KV 8x188g=1504g
    2x 6000 mAh 22V = 2x 960g = 1920g (It's says battery from HobbyKing but there is no Li-ion batteries for sale there any way 12000mAh in Li-ion technology - 6S4P 6x4=24x47.5g = 1140g+60h for wires )

    It gives total = 4224g not 3.18kg... (3500g with li-ion)

    And I'm not counting any frame, propelers, ESC's and so one.

    Log is missing most important data - Power during flight....

    Why some one post something like this?

    Total of

    • MR60

      for those wondering ... they are talking about a different flight

  • MR60
    so Gary, does this mean I get the MR90 badge? :-)
  • MR60

    Glad to report that one motor/prop/esc manufacturer is working with us thanks to this world record process. Kindness, sharing, hard work, and optimism does pay off.

  • Hi Gary,

    I flew today for 1 hour 33 minutes and 14 seconds (93.23 minutes) after two previous failed tries. Today I covered some distance and altitudes of well over 100 feet with a rechargeable battery powered multi-rotor in the "Multirotor Flight Endurance Challenge".  What would you like me to provide in terms of documentation to accept this as the first MR90 flight?  I posted two pictures of the flight and listed the building components so that anyone would have a good chance to duplicate a flight duration time of over 90 minutes.

    Have you had time to create the page mentioned in your February 7 post and where will it be? 

    Thanks for all your work,

    James B Frantz

    Scottsdale, AZ

  • I am wrong!

    In fact, it is reasonably trustworthy link. With each achievement, you have a youtube video link. Perfect!

This reply was deleted.

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