Hi all, i'm starting to think at a new project that a big seafood company gave me. The need it's an all wheater, autonomus survey boat and withdrawal of waters capability.
The budget it's around 50k euros and it's an European Founding with the aim of increasing production in agriculture and fish farming.
the boat will be 2.7 meters long and 1.2 wide, equipped with radar, side scanner sonar, stabilized Flir unit, RC, A/V transmission and data link.
The engines will be equipped with remote electric start and an electric power generator for the onboard systems.
The hull will be designed and built by a close friend (who has made the design of the Pagani Huayra and of the Lamborghini Aventador), even in carbon fibre if required.
We thought about two gas engine, with water jet, for main propulsion and an electric one, propeller line, for auxiliary power.(but maybe two gas engine are enough redundant...)
Most of the electronic components come from the real boats , but the autopilot system might be the Pixhawk, otherwise wich system could be better?
Would like to ask your advice ( or many more if you like ) on how to use the autopilot to steer the boat .
I am referring to the hardware, firmware ,settings and the tests to be performed , but also how to fix the rudder movement ( servants with rods or linear actuators for example ).
I would also like to know if it is possible for the Pixhawk to interact with a real boat radar system (eg to stop the boat in the event of presence within a certain distance of floating objects or vessels).
otherwise ,such transmission sistems using? such frequencies for RC , data link , A / V ?
The specifics asks for 5 km transmission range for each tx.
How you can understand i'm not expert with this system as I always used DJI product for my flying machines, I mean even boats , to the truth , but construction problems, I can delegate them to more experienced people.
Thx for help and if someone wants to be part of the project let me know.
Replies
I have ready technology solution to meet your needs.
Please email me
darius
manta103g@gmail.com
This project is a little . . . hard to understand.
The image provided is of a high speed attack boat, fitted with commercial radar and other systems and if I am not mistake is already in production.
The claim that this boat is 2.7m is also hard to believe. It is stated that the boat is fitted with twin Kemawa jet powered by Rolls Royce engines, nothing either Kemawa or Rolls Royce make will fit in a 2.7m boat little alone two, that I am aware of.
Also this boat design is completely wrong for bottom surveying, the hull has a step dead rise, meaning at low speeds the boat would rock alot, this boat is designed for high speed.
Also jet drives are not designed for low speed maneuverability, jet drive are very inefficient at low speeds and require greater energy to get on plane, once on plane jet drives are efficient mostly due to the reduced wetted surface and no appendages to create drag. An for that same reason cannot steer without thrust.
You would be better suited to a cat with pod drives (x4).
But as everyone has stated this is no hobby project, firstly it is illegal to operate a boat of the size with out a licensed captain at the helm. Secondly any EU funding would require a commercial Auto pilot.
I agree with Darius, contact your local university and establish a R&D cooperation.
Cheers,
RS
Hi all,
Thanks for your suggestions. The attached picture, i'm sorry, it is just an icon of pure imagination, thought attractive positioning of lights, radar and gimbal in superstructures...that's all. The shape of the hull, as well as the feasibility of the project itself are still under evaluation.
"">This is why I asked you to tell me what you thought.
"">The idea of a multi-hull, albeit not very pleasing to me, is actually the most suitable for maximum stability of the sensors in that type of water.
">For propulsion, I consider properly what was said by Mr Sterling, also about the strangeness of the project ...
And in fact true as stated on the efficiency of the water jet and as true as saying on the handling of the same. But what about the safety and the possibility that the propellers or pod drives can not be touched on algae, branches, ropes abandoned etc?
">The same problem can occur more easily with a multihull rather than a mono hull ... I do not know.
">The advice of Mr Darius Jack, in this sense, is very valuable and would ensure significant operational capabilities, cost reduction, simplification of the construction and design, but at the expense of camouflage for operations such as night security.
This lagoon measuring 7 km x 2 km and inside there are thousands of cages for breeding expensive shellfish.
">In that area, accessed from the Adrietic Sea by three inlets of 300 meters, there is free shipping.
">It happens that hundreds of episodes fishermen, boaters, anyone short, steal or try to steal these molluscs, with considerable damage yearly!
">The regular security service, composed of dozens of people, not helpful in solving problems, so it decided to change.The idea is to film and denounce the thieves by FLIR at night, as deterrent..
The Consortium of fishermen which manages these farms (1200 fishermen) has notevoil amministarzioni influences on local and could get special permission from the police to operate the testing by means not properly RC and even full-scale, obviously in different ways and times and regulated
">reported to mariners.
">This would solve the problems in the process of R & D.
">I agree with the idea to contact a university to get help and I will move in this direction too.
Can you link , if you know them, the best sites such as the nautical equipment for radar and sonar, rather than the pod electrical, etc.
Thx and regards.
@Andrea,
I tend to agree with Darius in that the project you describe is more in the commercial class than hobby class.
I am sure that there are a number of navigational control companies in Europe who would be glad to help you with your project by providing navigational control hardware and guidance.
Regards,
TCIII AVD
Hi, thanks for your reply.
I would like to clarify some aspects that probably in my post did not appear as I wanted.
First of all , that the budget that I mentioned is the maximum amount allowed by the European founding therefore not necessarily spending for the boat, as the project includes other things.
In fact, most of the cost is represented by the sensors: stabilized termal vision system Raymarine (€ 17k) and the possible radar (to be determined). "">Everything else, though very large, can and must originate modeling.
">The research team comprising two engineers, an aeronautical expert and a nautical and an industrial designer's intention is to create a custom boat, derived from modeling, but it should be able to carry out the missions of the above.
">Among other things if we were to buy a product out of the box and set, I think it would need a budget double than expected, given that the above mentioned models, come to € 35K!
Regarding the propulsion would say that the idea of the jet powered by gasoline engines (not gas turbine) comes from the fact that these systems provide much more autonomy for the same fuel transported (gasoline-battery) and above all do not represent a danger ">as the propellers shaft.
">In addition, the lagoon in which it will operate the boat, has in some sections depth of 50 cm and algae which would make the propellers little suitable for the purpose.
The boat will absolutely not travel at high speeds, but instead to guarantee a stable and safe navigation (15-20 kmH max), time to respond to our friend Jack Darius, who has perhaps confused the prestigious CV of the designer with the purpose of our ">project that certainly does not intend to emulate the famous brand of sports cars ...
So hull, engines, water jets, servos, hardware, autopilot, GPS, antennas Vtx and RC, telemetry, antenna tracking and radio remote control must be derived from modeling (Mr Coyle III, an autopilot mechanism with oleo dynamic boat full scale weight like half 'boat and the normal on-board radar are not suitable for a radio-controlled model given which are huge and require a control panel board and not in GS).
">I would rather understand why an electrical system would be the only one capable of operating for a long time long distance according to Mr Darius Jack, that despite claims to have made a self-combustion, fully functional.
I am not clear what problems it can create a 2km away or after 2 hours of sailing, in a gasoline engine working perfectly. Could be a problem for the Pixhawk autopilot manage a carburetor boat rather than an ESC one?
@Andrea,
what about an Airboat, to solve your problems with operation in the lagoon ?
http://www.yelp.com/biz_photos/boggy-creek-airboat-rides-kissimmee-...
Speed can be reduced to limit vibrations and noise affecting sensors and computer board
">In addition, the lagoon in which it will operate the boat, has in some sections depth of 50 cm and algae which would make the propellers little suitable for the purpose."
"
Dear Andrea,
50k euros projects don't get awarded to hobby modeller and his/her friend.
So your big company should buy ready-made rc boat or establish R&D cooperation link
with local university to develop such boat.
Electric motor is the only one you can control remotely over the long range and long operation time.
2 electric motors ( one as a backup in case of 1 motor failure)
PX is ok.
I develop bow-mount 2-stroke motor to support autopilot and counterdrift at fixed geolocation.
The same 2-stroke motor operates 3-phase generator (lightweight gas powered generator).
Your hull can easily collapse to one side, so forget gas turbine, forget Lamborghini.
You need to build your boat made of 2 parts, 100% sealed underwater part featuring all hardware, motors, electronics, control, radar, radio, battery,
and overwater part featuring aerial, sealed sensors, solars and nice design.
In case of EU funding it takes 12 months of paper work to get project and funding approved.