I spent a year working on APM 2.5 and 2.6, frying regulators one after another, breaking cables, crashing multis and planes because of weak connections or light entering into the barometer...
I purchased the FY41 lite for a cheaper price than the APM, and it had a GPS, a pitot sensor for airspeed, and even an OSD working perfectly from the start, Did I mention that all cable plugs were also rock-solid and that leds were giving easy-to-remember messages to pilot ?
My FY41 lite was fully operational after 3 evenings working on it and 3 morning tests, and it brought to me the immense joy of reading the OSD on my FPV screen from the very first test. I could even change AP parameters from within the OSD, using my Futaba transmitter joysticks to change basic options.
Now the FY41 lite is not perfect, it has a GCS that truly sucks, or an RTL with a fixed altitude (50 meters), and one needs to purchase the premium version for only 20 waypoints max.
But now I know that it is possible to build a rock solid AP
So 3DR, as long as you keep that "Dear customer, stop complaining, we are DIY, you should accept technical issues" attitude, I will stay away from you.
BTW, your prices are far from DIY compared to the competition.
This morning, I put all my second-hand APM stuff on Ebay. I am angry because it made me lose a big amount of time and money.
Now if I hear in one year that you got the message and seriously upgraded the quality of your components, and that you offer a plug-and-play OSD from scratch, then I shall revert because I am in love with your GCS, your unlimited waypoints and your user community.
Cheers.
Replies
So, what's your r/c experience and have you flown before you started putting together the 3DR stuff?
I have two people who have NEVER done r/c before and they both got their APM/Pixhawk running on a quad just fine. They had other issues not related to the APM but their own setup but I helped them out and they were just fine. In their case, it was definitely user error and I was able to help.
The DF13 is a pain unless you remove the connector properly, which is not easy unless you have access to where you can get a flathead screwdriver in. That I agree is a bit annoying but pulling on the wire to remove them is user error as you're not supposed to do that on anything to remove plugs, regardless of what kind of cable it is. People keep pulling USB cables, appliance cables not from the plug at the wall but at the cable all the time. Just because it doesn't break the first 20 times doesn't make it right as you're supposed to pull at the plug, not on the cables. DF13 is the same. I sold something to a guy and he said it didn't work because the telemetry module didn't work. After buying him a new one, troubleshooting for another hour over the phone, I found he pulled the cable, ruined the connector, and also did something else he didn't specify that would have solved the original problem and saved me a telemetry module. Again, user error because he pulled the cable, not the connector.
When it comes to the "DF13 B.S." you mention, I assume you never pulled on the wires/cables and always used the plug right? If not, well, what do you expect? The plug did it's job and kept the wires in place.
Spending "hundreds of hours searching for the piece of information" (one thing) is a complete waste of time and you should have asked if you couldn't find it after an hour or two. That's different from following the manual, which people just gloss over many times and end up skipping something that is again, user error, not the fault of 3DR or any documentation when one doesn't follow it as outlined.
I will sum it up in one sentence : Sophistication doesn’t necessarily mean complexity.
Whether 3DR gets my message or not, that is 3DR decision. If they have questions, they know how to contact me.
I will stop writing here, now i can concentrate on flying. At last.
Cheers to all
It all depends on what your definition of sophistication is. If your expectation of a sophisticated autopilot is different than the developers or 3DR, then how are they supposed to manage your expectation? What exactly was marketed to you that you considered sophisticated that the FY41 has that the APM doesn't have other than setup? When you expect fully RTF out of a bunch of components that require setup on the part of the user, you'll be disappointed as you found out.
I am sorry but I have to agree. I have had three APMs over the years; I have had them working great on the excellent Mission Planner, but never in the air despite reading, what must be by now, close to all there is about APMs. So, finally, I bought a NAZA M. It worked out of the box with gps and osd - plug and play - okay, so a little setting up on the software.
I didn't like the way the NAZA throttle is managed on multicopters (shuts down at half throttle) with this device, so bought a Feiyu Tech Dos (after shutting the motors off in flight and crashing a quad). Again with osd and gps. Again it worked out of the box and is an excellent piece of kit - sketchy software but it DOES work. Finally, because it was cheap, I bought a Naze 32, again it works - okay the osd took a little setting up and there's is a bit of soldering to do, but nothing like the APM set up.
Some of these units cost more to buy than the APM, but I have been flying them without spending heaps of money afterwards; and they fly and keep going reliably - something I have never had from the APM.
So, why am I sorry to agree with the op? It's because I love the idea of the APM and all the potential it has; the fantastic Mission Planner. I'm sorry because I would have loved to have achieved reliable flight with my APMs, but it never happened - despite spending shedloads on them. I used to write computer programmes during my research days, but I cannot program my APMs to stay in the air.
Can we not have an APM that you don't need to be a genius to operate? I do love to mess about with stuff, but hands up; the APMs have beaten me.
As far as breaking cables.... I assume you are talking about DF13s?
Hi Philip,
- I purchased a genuine 3DR APM 2.5 and a genuine 3DR 2.6 at full European 3DR reseller price (way higher than in the US) and one cheap clone from Hong Kong. Same problem on the 3 of them, worse indeed on the clone.
I had to tape the inside plastic case of all of them... to make it better, and I believe many people here had the same problem. What woud you say about buying a new computer and have to put some tape on the keyboard to make it work ? Classy !
http://www.suasnews.com/2012/11/19816/3dr-announce-new-apm2-5/ :
"The inside of the enclosure is lined with ESD safe open cell foam " . That must be what you are saying, that the 2.5+ from November 2012 did not have this problem anymore. I guess I purchased an old 2.5 version from the European reselllers stock.... Then why would there be the same problem on the 2.6, I just do not know. Anyway...
- And yes indeed, I talk about those DF13s, which I understand (but I am hopefully wrong) are present also in the new Pixhawk; which would be really bad to say the least. The FY41 lite is using solid standard servos connections, why just not doing the same thing ? Unless you want customers to have to re-order spares ?
Check-out what the competition is doing when cloning/improving the Pixhawk...
The whole meaning of my message is that 3DR can do it... should 3DR managers care about their customers experience as much as they care for new technology.
I saw the recent nomination of a famous person at 3DR marketing, I do hope that things will change for the better for 3DR.
Wait and see.
I wish you all the best with your new Autopilot. I do hope that you will try the Pixhawk at some stage, and have a look at the ArduPilot.com wiki, it has great tutorials on setting Ardupilot up. There are a lot of new features, like Auto tune, auto ground steering, and many others. The aircraft reliability has increased with Pixhawk dramatically with the addition of redundant IMU, and the EKF. Even dual GPS....
Yes the Pixhawk has DF13's, but if you grab one of the small plastic prying tools, they come off quite simply. The good thing with DF13, they will not come out in flight!
Anyway, all the best
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