Hi you all.
I'm new to arducopter drones, and drones at all..
I've built a Quad, using APM 2.8 Board (non-3DR), M8N Gps, 470kv 24p motors, 15x5,5 CF props, and tarot 650 CF frame, all running on 4s 10.000mah and turnigy 30A Plush ESC.
In the beggining all worked fine, i'm started to learn how to pilot the Quad, using stabilize and loiter. obviously loiter resulted more attractive because was hard to me maintain altitude when making horizontal displacement in stabilize..
some day the quad started to toiletbowl and i got scared and did everything wrong and crashed at high speed to a 25 meters tree, cutted off some branches, and fall down. Result: 1 broken arm, 2 wasted props, and complete landing gear destruction. apm and gps was scratched too.
recently i fixed the aircraft, and this time I DID COMPASSMOT (not done before!), to avoid toiletbowling. I mounted APM with 4 3M slow response foam earplugs in a double plate, and sticked to APM and frame with double-doublesided foam tape.
In stabilize is rock solid, but alt hold and loiter works weird.....
in loiter, when you let the quad hovering, it twitches the throttle, like an angry bee, i don't know how to explain. it's like the quad stops and re-run motors for a fraction of a second, and looses about 2 or 3 inches of altitude and go up again. its like a glitch. I tried to fly loiter anyway, was making squares about 2 meters above ground to practice, and suddenly... quad rocketed up in the sky... this time i was ready, and switched to stabilize. the quad started to fall, and with a throttle punch it leveled again, but at an altitude i never used it... so i decided to switch to LAND mode, and the quad suicided itself drifting away and descending too quick. this time: 2 more props wasted, and a crack in the lower main plate. gps stand was destroyed as usual..
i spended much money to start my aerial filming project, and i do not trust this aircraft to hang a professional camera on it. i thought it will be like a phantom, but bigger, nicer and stronger, capable of carrying a full dslr camera. But it is only a big and dangerous machine, and i'm hating it so hard.
i will leave you the last flight logs. if somebody with experience and expertise give me a hand and analyzes my logs, i will thank you very much.
i can only think i have a vibration issue, so i ordered a moongel pad to reinforce damping.
The big problem is i'm in Argentina, and any replacement part or upgrade takes a month to arrive, and a ton of paperwork to claim it in customs..
looking forward to fix this, and sorry for my neanderthal english.
Juan.
Replies
-- I wouldn't bother talking to manufacturers. Multirotor hardware is all sold as is, with no guarantees of compatibility.
-- i will not bother manufacturers... calling china to complain for my own lack of knowledge sounds foolish.
It's easy to email every manufacturer on the globe and get kind reply and advice next day.
My friend just replaced 50 broken LED bulbs directly with China manufacturer
for free in one day.
-- Multirotor hardware is all sold as is, with no guarantees of compatibility.
Manufacturers of MR hardware parts are really friendly guys, represented at rcgroups.
You can get full service, advice, manuals for free.
They know they business very well supplying RC developers for years.
If you are building DIY Drone from a Kit you exactly need to source hardware parts to match each other, exactly as in professional aircraft industry, equipped with labs, testing sites and full staff.
- And almost zero parts will list resonant frequency
Selecting low resonance airframe is basics for your success since resonant vibrations can damage motors or shorten their life cycle, can damage sensors, connectors, battery.
If you source for electronic parts to be exposed to resonant vibrations of airframe,
you really need to tell about it to supplier or manufacturer.
-- And Drone Certified (TM) is a term made up by Darius, it is not real.
I hope Drone Certified (TM) to win global recognition in RC worlds within next few months as a global standard.
So Drone Certified (TM) is exactly for real,
by Open Technology Park,
Open Fabrication Labs
Stephen: Thank you for taking the time to write. May be the windy conditions yesterday making a difference in my Z axis? i will read carefully the page you said. May autotune be a previous step to manual tunning? or is preferable to first do a manual tunning and then go for autotune? please give me advise on this, because i'm going all-in on tunning.. :D
I live on a small town in patagonia, so i'm sure there is no other apm users in here to ask for help. i'm on my own with this, and counting on community help like yours.
i will not bother manufacturers... calling china to complain for my own lack of knowledge sounds foolish. may be i can offer darius a million dollars to come here and help me. Thath sounds like a good idea!! lol
Yes, windy made the difference, your z vibes looks well, your x and y are bigger, I hope for your props near the controller.
Juan:
I think your focus on tuning will help your situation. You only need very basic performance in alt hold to do your auto tune.
Sometimes, it is necessary to change the PID setting before getting acceptable alt hold performance.
In my case with a heavy Y6, I needed to set estimated settings to get off the ground. If you feel completely out of control then you might need to read and try to understand the PID settings so you can manually change the settings to achieve rough alt hold. The a successful auto tune will then get you more stable.
Hey, I forgot you stated the APM wont support autotune? Are you sure? Well, if not, the Wiki has good information on tuning prior to autotune. Read everything first, then setup a tuning knob on your remote to ch6, then tune one PID value at a time, very carefully. Tuning is a big topic, but will make your craft stable. You have no hope for stable flight with a home built drone without tuning.
Thanks Harry! i didn't want to state apm don't support autotune, sorry if i did that. My english isn't so good. I saw a lot of vids on youtube showing arducopter autotune on apm copters. i tried to ask what should i do first: Manual PID Tunning or Autotune?
Now, here we are facing our second day of windstorm "Puelche", so no chance of flight. in addition, winds are raising volcanic ashes from the ground (from last eruption of a chilean volcano relatively close) and going out is messy and "Ashy". So, using free time indoors to read and prepare action for next windcalm day. May be good if i upload some pictures of the quad so everyone can see my build and look for any mistakes.
Juan: APM and 3.2.1 supported autotune pitch and roll, not supported yaw; you need to have a reasonable alt hold to use autotune, If you can´t fly in Alt hold, you need to be able first or you are in crash risk.
@Juan,
"
there is a lot of ardupilots flying out there without rpm feedback from escs. i just want mine flying like those.
and i don't want to spend any more money on it.
"
Option 1.
I need log files for the correctly tuned and correctly controlled, responding DIYQuad
of your type or alike
"
I've built a Quad, using APM 2.8 Board (non-3DR), M8N Gps, 470kv 24p motors, 15x5,5 CF props, and tarot 650 CF frame, all running on 4s 10.000mah and turnigy 30A Plush ESC."
to study correct log data charts (signatures) vs. your log data charts (signatures)
- Master follow Yoga approach
Option 2
My friends developed in San Francisco micro jobs service turned into global success.
Just offer $5 or $10 reward for:
"I want you to tune my quad to fly safely"
...
..
Option 3
Contact sellers of your quad's hardware parts asking them if the delivered parts
has beeen pretested to fit your Quad type, airframe -
ask them if the parts have been Drone Certified (TM)
It may be the case, delivered hardware parts have inbuilt limitations to work properly
for your Quad configuration.
Ask every seller for a manual for every part, technical specification, performance charts.
Contact manufacturer of your airframe for resonance frequency charts, frequency ranges.
It may be the case, your airframe if not fit for your project and there is no solution
to damp amplitude of resonant frequencies within a given RPM range .
We are not lazy but I have studied interactive media, communications at MIT, MediaLab, MediaMOO 25 years ago, so if charts have been attached by you, we can easily discuss the problem in interactive way.
If not, how could we find solution to your problems.
So now I need ppl to attach log files to feature safely flying quads
to build Yoga Follow Me library of the correct data signatures for
Acc, Baro, Speed, Gyro, GPS ... charts.
btw
Just offer $1 for the job to be done for you in public.
Payment via Paypal
If $1 cannot do the trick just ask "how much" and forget your problems soon.
Ppl from San Franciso did hundreds of micro jobs that way.
Juan, don't be discouraged. All home built drones are difficult to get flying at first.
I do not consider myself a big expert, but I have built two heavy lift camera drones, the first with APM 2.5 and the current with Pixhawk FC. Each had trouble at first. Forgive me if I am stating the obvious.
My suggestions:
1. Read carefully and follow the Wiki section on first flight, particularly the compass calibration, ESC calibration.
2. Do a test very simple test flight. Check your logs for vibration and electromagnetic interference. The Wiki will show you how to do this.
3. Fly only in stabilize and alt hold modes until you have succeeded with Autotune.
4. Read the Wiki sections on GPS glitch parameters.
Don't Stop!, you will find the reasons for your bad behavior.
Hi! Thank you for your reply.
Since i'm on APM, a can not install 3.3, so i can't auto calibrate ESC. what should i do to calibrate ESCs manually?
vibrations are on the limits of acceptable levels stated on the wiki.
Seeing other posts i realized how important autotune is. i NEVER did an autotune, so i think is a good place to start. i'm not very comfortable going 5 meters high to do it, i don't trust althold so much to do that, but if it is the only way to go.
AccZ levels of my quad are safe to use AltHold??
if not, well.... i will have to go for vibrations first. and already did a earplug mount, so... whats next? adding weight to fc? a wooden cube taped to fc will help?
Thank you all
I found This.
when i switch to loiter, he ThrOut value gets totally messed up. What can be????
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